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Two Years, 43 Chapters, 203,617 Words

Marc Nobbs 🚫

Apologies, I just needed to share...

After two years,

43 Chapters,

203,617 words.

It is 22:45 on Thursday, 15th May 2025, and I just typed these words at the end of the manuscript.

THE END OF 'A HEALING LOVE'

THE PAUL ROBERTSON SAGA WILL BE CONTINUED

You have no idea how high I am right now.

Still some hard work ahead. Editing, formatting, more editing, revision after revision.

But GOOD GOD DAMN, I'm so happy right now.

akarge 🚫

@Marc Nobbs

Congratulations

Crumbly Writer 🚫

@Marc Nobbs

It's always a pleasure passing such a significant threshold, clearing your agenda for other works. Yet, sometimes, once you're 'done' with a project, they have a way of resurrecting themselves, as you suddenly get new insights into HOW the characters, and the story, can start anew and refreshed, breathing new life into an old story.

In my own works, I've done that three to five times (?), yet it usually happens with extended series, rather than single stories, as the protagonists tend to evolve, become more complete and complex, with each iteration.

So, have fun, yet don't be too surprised if those earlier characters crawl out of their crypts and start speaking to you late at night, urging a change for them to 'live again'. ;) It happens, though luckily, not that often. As some stories are better off dying, 'dead and buried' as they say.

And of course, the "will be continued" reflects your intent, so it's hardly the same case.

Marius-6 🚫

@Marc Nobbs

Congratulations!

Switch Blayde 🚫

@Marc Nobbs

You have no idea how high I am right now.

I do. The feeling of completing the first draft is the best.

Grey Wolf 🚫

@Marc Nobbs

Congratulations!

I remember that feeling when I finished the first draft of Variation on a Theme, Book 1. It's the only one where I've completed the book before publishing part of it - mostly because I wasn't going to start publishing anything before I proved to myself I could finish an entire book.

Enormous satisfaction! Much happiness!

And, yes, there's work ahead, but that's good work. Happy work, even.

Enjoy the success, and enjoy what comes next!

The Outsider 🚫

@Marc Nobbs

That feeling's eerie, isn't it?

Joe Long 🚫

@Marc Nobbs

11 years, 14, chapters, 159k words.

Another 5 chapters and I can share your elation.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer 🚫

@Joe Long

I've always focused on 'novel length' stories (60,000 to 105,000 words, over twenty-something chapters) as I've NEVER written a saga length novel which are so common on SOL.

That so, I published posted 57 different books, and roughly 33 complete novels, as the others are typically a single series or a sample read along a given theme. Plus, I've retired quite a few, some because I was once considering republishing them and others because I decided they no longer reflecting my writing style any more.

But my initial SOL story, before I began self-publishing, was well over 1.1 million words, which I subsequently split into sex different volumes, adding to that overall size. And while I could list a total word count, with so many published posted works, it really isn't worth running those numbers.

But from a rudimentary guess, 37 full novels at, say, an average of 85,000 words, leaving me with a roughly 3.2 million words, though again, that estimate is on the conservative (i.e. low) side.

Replies:   Joe Long
Joe Long 🚫

@Crumbly Writer

Sometimes I kick out a short story but OTA is my main project, where I'm midway thru the third (and final) act. I started with a defined story arc and conclusion and didn't want the story and characters to wander into an undefined future with no goal in sight. I agree that 60k to 100k is a nice length for ready, although I don't mind up to 200k, and have a read a few mainstream longer novels recently.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer 🚫

@Joe Long

Again, I've always been a novel writer, but I'm now flirting with novellas. Before I was trying to add chapters to reach a full novel, yet in the end, that's just filler and isn't essential to the underlying story. And it's not like I have written an extra-long novella before, which was one of my proudest works.

Yet now, I'm getting some prodding to finally submitting to be published by a mainstream publisher. I already have the story, and it'll still have sex and plenty of erotica, but none of my usual pseudo incest or other SOL inclinations.

I need a new challenge before finally shuffling off to my mortal coil, one last line on my final semi-literary epitaph. However, it'll keep my most recent SOL stories on hold for even longer.

And of course, traditional publishers are the ones who set those story length standards in the first place.

Replies:   Joe Long
Joe Long 🚫

@Crumbly Writer

It turns out that OTA will take low 200k to tell the story. That's the way it turned out, and at least in story based erotica, that's not unusual (and I don't even have a "lot" of sex.) I have another idea with less sex, a historical relationship drama set between 1935-1946. I envision it in novella length (40-50k) but would be surprised if it gets to 100 once I work on it in earnest. New ideas keep popping into my head. In the almost finished ch14 for OTA, I was worried if I'd get to 10k words, and now it's 1t 19. More than I planned but I think vital to the plot and characters. It's that I want the chapters to have their own plot arc as well and I'm not going to end the chapter at some random point in time.

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer 🚫

@Joe Long

Technically, a novella runs from 1,500 to 15,000+ words, so there's plenty of wiggle room for anyone. As I've always written extremely long novels, yet never attempted a saga, which have always been popular on SOL.

I prefer the structure of 'publication' standards, as it allow me to better focus on the stories, without getting overwhelmed in the details. I understand both sides, yet for me, I just prefer shorter, tighter, more concise novels than the looser, longer saga. But that's just my preference, as I also LOVE those saga too.

Replies:   awnlee jawking
awnlee jawking 🚫
Updated:

@Crumbly Writer

Technically, a novella runs from 1,500 to 15,000+ words

A novelette runs from 7,500 to 17,500 or so words.

AJ

Replies:   jimq2  Crumbly Writer
jimq2 🚫

@awnlee jawking

From Wikipedia:

A range between 17,500 and 40,000 words is commonly used for the novella category, whereas 7,500–17,500 is commonly used for novelettes.

awnlee jawking 🚫

@jimq2

A range between 17,500 and 40,000 words is commonly used for the novella category

I've seen that stated elsewhere too.

One issue I have is the boundary between novella and novel. I've seen books in the 40,000 to 50,000 word range described as a 'short novel'. I'm not comfortable describing works of less than 50,000 words as a novel; 40,000 to 50,000 is an uncomfortable gap.

AJ

Dominions Son 🚫

@awnlee jawking

One issue I have is the boundary between novella and novel.

Another thing that people need to consider is that typical novel sizes vary by genre.

There are some genres where 40KW is typical. Then for fantasy and science fiction, the average is closer to 80KW.

Personally I would say that a Novella should be at least half the size of a typical novel in it's genre.

awnlee jawking 🚫

@Dominions Son

Personally I would say that a Novella should be at least half the size of a typical novel in it's genre.

That makes sense because some authors bundle two or more novellas together in one publication.

AJ

Replies:   Crumbly Writer
Crumbly Writer 🚫

@awnlee jawking

Well … technically those are considered "Compilations", not novellas, which are also distinct from "Samplers", say where you offer only the first chapters or a series of short stories with a common theme, so readers can cheaply determine which books or authors they're interested in purchasing.

Crumbly Writer 🚫

@Dominions Son

That's true, yet it's better familiarizing yourself with that genre's specific expectations, as those expectations are generally determined by the readers themselves. Which is why romances used to be smaller than other genres, and now that they've added more explicit content, are substantially longer than they were.

Yes, I do keep track of such industry trends, both for traditionally and independently-published works, as I've always been a stickler for details. (Self-obsessed is another way of saying it.)

Crumbly Writer 🚫

@awnlee jawking

Unfortunately, doing so it likely to leave you with dissatisfied readers feeling cheated by doing so. It happens, not always, yet it's better knowing before trying it. And adding extra value for their purchase is always viewed as a bonus, not a lossβ€”unless the whole story is crap, of course. ;)

Which is also known to happen.

Crumbly Writer 🚫
Updated:

@jimq2

Fine, pad your stories all you want. I'm just saying it's not strictly necessary, as I've never had a book rejected for giving readers extra content, as that directly benefits the author, the publisher and the posting site, so they're only hurting themselves and their readers, thus earning less doing so.

You do the math for yourself. Or not, as we all do whatever the hell we want to anyway. As noted, I merely suggest alternatives, as it's not my story, and I have no involvement and no investment in it.

Crumbly Writer 🚫

@awnlee jawking

Yeah, those are the formal definitions, yet most tend to be less strict on the upper end. The minimums are often absolute, yet the total lengths are mostly vague guidelines, simply for categorization purposes.

Despite being a novelists, I have written a few, longer novelettes rather than 'padding' the shorter stories with mere space fillers. I prefer the stories being the length they need to be, than arbitrarily determining what I can trim and what I can't.

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